airtraffic

Author Topic: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's  (Read 243 times)

Offline KC2555

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AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« on: July 19, 2019, 11:23:24 AM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.



Offline tyketto

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2019, 12:37:52 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Offline gsengle

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2019, 05:25:42 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

Offline tyketto

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2019, 06:25:22 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

I never said that at all. What I am saying is that the rules that they are following are coming into conflict with rules that we are supposed to follow, all because the airlines are taking their time - for one reason or another - in resolving the actual problem, which is to follow the AD. All of this boils down to what our first Postmaster General had to say:

Those who sacrifice their freedoms for safety and security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

BL.

Offline gsengle

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2019, 06:41:05 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

I never said that at all. What I am saying is that the rules that they are following are coming into conflict with rules that we are supposed to follow, all because the airlines are taking their time - for one reason or another - in resolving the actual problem, which is to follow the AD. All of this boils down to what our first Postmaster General had to say:

Those who sacrifice their freedoms for safety and security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

BL.

Except flying on an airliner together with other members of the public on a private carrier isn’t a right. You wanna fly you follow the rules.

Offline tyketto

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2019, 01:02:23 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

I never said that at all. What I am saying is that the rules that they are following are coming into conflict with rules that we are supposed to follow, all because the airlines are taking their time - for one reason or another - in resolving the actual problem, which is to follow the AD. All of this boils down to what our first Postmaster General had to say:

Those who sacrifice their freedoms for safety and security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

BL.

Except flying on an airliner together with other members of the public on a private carrier isn’t a right. You wanna fly you follow the rules.

The 4A is a right. When their rules conflict with the 4A, you have a major problem.

BL.

Offline gsengle

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2019, 01:37:25 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

I never said that at all. What I am saying is that the rules that they are following are coming into conflict with rules that we are supposed to follow, all because the airlines are taking their time - for one reason or another - in resolving the actual problem, which is to follow the AD. All of this boils down to what our first Postmaster General had to say:

Those who sacrifice their freedoms for safety and security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

BL.

Except flying on an airliner together with other members of the public on a private carrier isn’t a right. You wanna fly you follow the rules.

The 4A is a right. When their rules conflict with the 4A, you have a major problem.

BL.

Nope. It prevents unreasonable search and seizure by the government. It doesn’t guarantee carriage on an airplane. I think you’d agree that the Supreme Court is fine with the TSA. To end such security would end airlines as we know them. I’m sick of extremist “libertarians”.

Offline tyketto

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Re: AD Regarding Cell Phone Use on 737's and 777's
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2019, 06:43:39 PM »
I read the attached article from Bloomberg yesterday and wondered how much of a risk cell phone use is on these two planes. Is there a tipping point for when passenger phones in full cell phone mode would actually interfere with cockpit instruments - e.g., 10 phones, no problem; 30 phones, a problem, etc. I realize the best solution to this is simply for all to comply with flight attendant instructions and put our phones in airplane mode. I am just wondering about the risk profile since it is clear that many people do not toggle into airplane mode. Side note ... on a recent Southwest flight, the flight attendant actually announced they would confiscate any devices not in airplane mode and only return them to the passenger after landing. Sounds like they are getting more serious about enforcing this rule.

Or actually, the best solution would be if the airlines complied with the AD, which they have until November 2019 to replace those screens. Additionally, how will a flight attendant know if a person's phone or device is NOT in airplane mode to confiscate it? At that point, the FARs come into conflict with the 4A.

So should the airlines "laziness" (lack of a better word) for not being proactive and pulling the aircraft out of operations to comply with the AD be justification for their flight attendants to be overreaching in their use of federal law and leave the passengers not safe and secure in their person and property?

BL.

Your aren’t suggesting that we shouldn’t follow federal law as well as obey flight crew instructions? Follow the rules and you’re good. Hell, give the FAs cellphone transmission detectors - now you’ll see some compliance...

I never said that at all. What I am saying is that the rules that they are following are coming into conflict with rules that we are supposed to follow, all because the airlines are taking their time - for one reason or another - in resolving the actual problem, which is to follow the AD. All of this boils down to what our first Postmaster General had to say:

Those who sacrifice their freedoms for safety and security deserve neither. - Ben Franklin

BL.

Except flying on an airliner together with other members of the public on a private carrier isn’t a right. You wanna fly you follow the rules.

The 4A is a right. When their rules conflict with the 4A, you have a major problem.

BL.

Nope. It prevents unreasonable search and seizure by the government. It doesn’t guarantee carriage on an airplane. I think you’d agree that the Supreme Court is fine with the TSA. To end such security would end airlines as we know them. I’m sick of extremist “libertarians”.

You still do not get it. When you have FARs requiring passenger compliance, especially when it comes to confiscating your personal property, it can not be required of the airlines to do that without reasonable doubt, let alone documentation establishing the right to confiscate that property (read: warrant). Again, the law is in conflict with the regulation, which would need to be tested in court.

Additionally, none of this would be an issue whatsoever if the airlines complied with the AD that they have had in their hands to deal with for over a year, which their deadline is coming up in 4 month's time. Yet you give them no heartburn about that, do you?

And I am far from a libertarian. I happen to know my rights both on and off an aircraft and require proper documentation before any of my property is confiscated.

BL.