airtraffic

Author Topic: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA  (Read 241295 times)

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #25 on: March 09, 2014, 05:39:09 PM »
"Sunday, March 09, 02:43 PM MYT +0800 Malaysia Airlines MH370 Flight Incident - 8th Media Statement

Statement by MAS GCEO, Ahmad Jauhari Yahya

Together with all those affected by the MH370 incident, we understand the need to provide regular updates on the progress of the search and rescue operations.  As the hours turn into days, we at Malaysia Airlines are similarly anxious and we appreciate the patience, support and prayers from everyone.

We however acknowledge that the most affected group in this incident is the families of those on-board. As such, our primary focus at this point in time is to care for the families. This means providing them with timely information, travel facilities, accommodation, meals and emotional support. Initial financial assistance has been given out to all families. Caregivers are already assigned to each family and they are trained staff and volunteers from Malaysia and Australia.

Family members of the MH370 passengers from Beijing who wish to travel will be flown in stages to Kuala Lumpur on the available flights.  We are also communicating with the families from other nations to similarly arrange for their travel to Kuala Lumpur.

In the event flight MH370 is located, a Response Control Centre (RCC) in the area will be activated to support the needs of families.

The airline continues to work with the authorities and we appreciate the help we are receiving from all parties during this critical and difficult time"

http://www.malaysiaairlines.com/my/en/site/dark-site.html

Offline avalon

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 41
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2014, 06:19:16 PM »
Something which struck me as disturbing about this incident involving MH 370 was the premature release of the passenger manifest (yesterday) on Malaysian Airlines website.  Having served on an emergency response team for a major airline I find it difficult to believe all next of kin would have been notified so quickly.  Also, the Italian passport who's rightful owner was found not to have boarded MH 370 would have been known prior to publishing his name online.   

Offline avalon

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 41
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2014, 06:38:39 PM »
Quote
The pilot of another flight told a Malaysian newspaper he had made brief contact with the plane via his emergency frequency, at the request of Vietnamese aviation authorities who had been unable to reach it as expected. Vietnam has said it believes the flight never entered its airspace
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/mar/09/malaysia-airlines-missing-plane-fears-worst

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2014, 07:04:37 PM »
Probably not related to the incident, but worth mentioning that the aircraft involved is 9M-MRO (Boeing 777-2H6/ER cn 28420/404), this very same aircraft had it's wingtip damaged in a ground collision in August 2012 at Shanghai with a China Eastern Airways Airbus A340-600 ...

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/missing-malaysia-airlines-jet-had-ground-collision-2012-n47706

It does make the mind recall China Airlines 611...on May 25, 2002, while operating the Taipei–Hong Kong route, Boeing 747-209B B-18255 broke up in-flight 20 minutes into the flight, killing all on board. The aircraft had suffered a tailstrike in 1980, was repaired, and put back into service. The repair work was sub-standard. While it lasted 22 years, it was eventually to blame for the crash.  
« Last Edit: March 09, 2014, 07:37:10 PM by joeyb747 »

Offline avalon

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 41
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #29 on: March 09, 2014, 07:26:43 PM »
Probably not related to the incident, but worth mentioning that the aircraft involved is 9M-MRO (Boeing 777-2H6/ER cn 28420/404), this very same aircraft had it's wingtip damaged in a ground collision in August 2012 at Shanghai with a China Eastern Airways Airbus A340-600 ...

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-jet/missing-malaysia-airlines-jet-had-ground-collision-2012-n47706


https://twitter.com/MarySchiavo/status/442647017668759552/photo/1

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #31 on: March 10, 2014, 06:28:36 AM »
I think what is important now is to find the plane now with almost 12 countries with 32 aircraft fixed winged and rotary  winged  and more than 45 warships searching for the plane and now I hear with Satellite coverage they are still unable to detect even a piece of the Boeing 777  plane . we will then be able to answer all our questions to what happen to the plane .    


Update: There is news coming in that there is a fleet of Malaysian Fishing Boats of about 100 Ships mustering preparing to enter the Search area but this is not conformed.  
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 06:44:38 AM by xiangster »

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #32 on: March 10, 2014, 07:29:59 AM »
The item that was seen floating on the surface, believed to be part of the airplane, has infact turned out to be a part of a cable reel. The oil slicks on the surface are still thought to be from the missing 777, but not confirmed. So at this point, searchers are still sitting on square one...

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #33 on: March 10, 2014, 08:06:35 AM »
This is the search area for now they are going to expand it soon .   The Small red cycle is the last known position of the plane

Update: Only one oil slick was tested and it was not from the plane  and other 'oil slicks' is confirmed as grease so back to square one again.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 09:02:55 AM by xiangster »

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #34 on: March 10, 2014, 11:50:14 AM »
The new Search area map to locate the plane it includes the distribution of search assets to different locations of search for air and sea and land yes they have started on the ground also   To Quote the Commander “We are every hour, every minute, every second looking at every inch of the sea,”
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 12:57:54 PM by xiangster »

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #35 on: March 10, 2014, 11:56:01 AM »
This pictures is from the Republic of Singapore Air Force C130 Search Plane on one of the sorties
  
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 01:23:31 PM by xiangster »

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #36 on: March 10, 2014, 12:07:25 PM »
These are the Malaysia search Warships and Chopper

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #37 on: March 10, 2014, 12:45:03 PM »
This is Vietnam's side of the Search Plane and choppers on Crew change
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 01:09:00 PM by xiangster »

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #38 on: March 10, 2014, 04:36:06 PM »
"An oil slick that searchers had thought might be from the plane turned out to be fuel oil typically used in cargo ships, according to Rahman."

From:

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/10/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-plane/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Square one...

Offline avalon

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 41
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #39 on: March 10, 2014, 04:55:24 PM »
For whatever reason I keep thinking there's a possibility the aircraft may have ended up in a remote jungle of Vietnam.  But, if that were the case one could argue there would be a signal emanating from the black box. 

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2014, 05:36:06 PM »
For whatever reason I keep thinking there's a possibility the aircraft may have ended up in a remote jungle of Vietnam.  But, if that were the case one could argue there would be a signal emanating from the black box. 

At this point, I would be open to any possibility...this aircraft and all of it's contents have simply vanished without a trace.

No Mayday, no explosion, no fireball, no floating debris, no fire on the surface of the water, no oil slick, no signal from the ELT, ...nothing...

Offline InterpreDemon

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 514
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #41 on: March 10, 2014, 06:33:22 PM »
Perhaps they flew into a time warp, and are now looking down at dinosaurs where Idlewild airport should be, but taking in all the latest... two passengers with stolen passports using cheap, one-way tickets purchased by an Iranian third party, I would put a hijack followed by suicide dive into the sea (like the EgyptAir flight) at the top of my probable cause list. A bomb at altitude would have spread floating debris for miles and miles, whereas diving straight into the water (or land) would leave the smallest debris footprint. Remember how long it took to find and recover debris from that ValuJet  crash in the Everglades, and that was with ample radar tracking data over land.  The lack of any distress call suggests either the sudden incapacitation or participation of those on the flight deck. If the aircraft was hijacked, perhaps with assistance of one or more of the crew, they could have pulled the breaker on the transponder and ADS-B, flown on to jungle of Viet Nam, dumping fuel along the way and then impaling themselves into the canopy with a similar residual crash site effect as lawn-darting themselves into the sea.

All we at the keyboards can do is speculate, but three things are for sure, 1) the aircraft is no longer airborne, 2) it will be found, and 3) we will be able to figure out what really happened.

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #42 on: March 10, 2014, 06:37:44 PM »
"Hong Kong's Air Traffic Control Center reported on Mar 10th 2014 around 17:30L (09:30Z) that an airliner enroute on airway L642 reported via HF radio that they saw a large field of debris at position N9.72 E107.42 about 80nm southeast of Ho Chi Minh City, about 50nm off the south-eastern coast of Vietnam in the South China Sea and about 281nm northeast of the last known radar position. Ships have been dispatched to the reported debris field.

Vietnam's Headquarters for the Search and Rescue operation of MH-370 confirmed receiving the report by Hong Kong's Air Traffic Control Center stating that a Hong Kong based airliner reported a large field of debris while enroute on airway L642. A Thai cargo ship in the area was asked for assistance and has set course to the area but did not find anything unusual so far. A second vessel asked for assistance did find some debris. Following this finding Vietnam's Maritime Search and Rescue Services (MRCC) dispatched a ship to the debris field.

Hong Kong's Civil Aviation Department confirmed a Cathay Pacific flight from Hong Kong to Kuala Lumpur spotted large amount of debris while enroute off the coast of South East Vietnam."


From the updated AvHerald article:

http://avherald.com/h?article=4710c69b&opt=0

The updated article also confirms that the first part seen floating in the ocean has been determined to be NOT part of the Boeing 777...
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 06:56:37 PM by joeyb747 »

Offline nick-mel

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #43 on: March 10, 2014, 08:12:24 PM »
I've been wondering about this all night and am curious about a couple of things (well a lot more, but these two main ones)

Does the 777 Satcom / ACARS/ FANS system(s) check in on a regular basis and provide a current GPS co-ordinate back to base?
From my brief reading, it looks like they can be disabled in the cockpit, but not sure.

I'm also curious about the huge search area that's being shown as being setup to the west side. (pic was posted a few posts up). Some of that area is a good 60-120mins+ flying time from the last reported location with a number of Mil and Commercial airports they would have had to come closeish to.
Its a long time since I've lived there, but there were a good few air force bases up the north end of Malaysia so presume there'd be a few mil radar's sweeping up there and at least three commerical airports (Penang, Langkawi and Phuket) come to mind in the area. Penang is in Sector D on the map, Langkawi in B and Phuket north of A. (Phuket being in Thailand not Malaysia of course). How likely is it that a 777 could fly ~90mins with no primary radar pickup through Thai airspace and likely within Malaysian radar range?
(For reference, the flight departed from KUL which is just inland of the SE corner of search area D

(First post after a while lurking in the shadows)

Nick

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #44 on: March 10, 2014, 09:23:49 PM »

Does the 777 Satcom / ACARS/ FANS system(s) check in on a regular basis and provide a current GPS co-ordinate back to base?
From my brief reading, it looks like they can be disabled in the cockpit, but not sure.


Welcome to the Threads Nick!

I do not believe it does. ACARS (Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System) can report OOOI (Out/Off/On/In) Events and technical issues with the aircraft to the ground. Unless the aircraft is having an issue, no automated communications would be transmitted from the aircraft until it lands at the destination if all systems are green. Once the OFF Event is recorded, an ETA at Destination would be transmitted. A position report could be sent by THE CREW, but not THE AIRPLANE. It also allows for Weather/Re-route information to be sent from the ground to the aircraft. Two way communication capability also exists in a form similar to the text messages we all get on our cell phone in which the number of topics open for discussion is endless. On 09/11, United Airlines sent ACARS messages to it's entire fleet warning of possible cockpit intrusion.    

Practically any system on the airplane can be "disabled" if the power is removed, either by the crew, or a mechanical failure resulting in loss of power. Air France 447 sent a flurry of ACARS messages during its final moments in the air because the power supply system was operating normally during the unplanned descent...

The FANS (Future Air Navigation System) on the other hand, does.

"AIRLINE OPERATIONAL CONTROL DATA LINK.
The AOC link gives airline data systems the ability to transmit new routes, position reports, and updated winds through the data link network."


From:

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/aero_02/textonly/fo02txt.html

The FANS is optional equipment however, and may have not been part of this aircraft's package. She was an "early" production -200 series, first flew on 14 May 2002, and delivered new to Malaysia Airlines on 31 May 2002. She would have turned 12 years old in a couple months time.

See also the file attached below for more info:
« Last Edit: March 10, 2014, 09:58:49 PM by joeyb747 »

Offline nick-mel

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 17
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #45 on: March 10, 2014, 10:12:30 PM »
Thanks,

That's the PDF I'd been reading beforehand, but couldn't work out if FANS was optional on 777's or std equipment from day 1. Looking at the Boeing link below "The 777 includes FANS 1 as a basic feature", but may still beg the question whether MAS utilised it.

N

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2014, 11:59:39 PM »
It is now more than 80 hours since the disappearance of the flight  with so many naval assets from all over the world  searching. I really hope to find at least one survivor, the plane or the black boxes to explain where and how the plane could just go missing.  FYI the Malaysian Government is still calling it a S&R mission I really hope they still can Rescue someone.     

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #47 on: March 11, 2014, 12:50:13 AM »
This photos are from the Royal Malaysian Air Force Search Chopper and The Elite Para Divers of the Royal Malaysian Armed Forces prepping and boarding for sortie.

Offline xiangster

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 25
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #48 on: March 11, 2014, 10:14:46 AM »
Looks like  the Plane change course and fly for an hour after vanishing from the radar over the Malacca Strait 500km which is now the last location according to the  RMAF Radar.

Offline joeyb747

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1745
  • Nothing Like A 747!
Re: Malaysia Airlines reports ATC loses contact with MAS370, WMKK-ZBAA
« Reply #49 on: March 11, 2014, 02:11:41 PM »
Looks like  the Plane change course and fly for an hour after vanishing from the radar over the Malacca Strait 500km which is now the last location according to the  RMAF Radar.

CNN confirms...

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/11/world/asia/malaysia-airlines-plane/index.html