Author Topic: Piper N132ND Beach Landing near JFK (Read 122726 times)

dave · « **Reply #50 on:** April 06, 2011, 21:17:24 UTC »

Quote from: mik_ny on April 06, 2011, 17:48:16 UTC

If any real world air traffic controllers in the Northeast US have additional details, information greatly appreciated.
[apology for sidetracking the forum topic thread. ]

Whether a track makes it to Flightaware and other tracking services depends on whether the tail number ends up in the National Airspace System (NAS) computers.

Here is what I know about that makes it into the NAS:

1) All IFR flights.
2) VFR Flight Following flights that cross ARTCC and TRACON boundaries (but not all).

Most TRACON/Approach Control facilities have their own set of "internal" squawk codes that are used inside their airspace. Those flights, as I understand it, never make it into the NAS. So, for example, if you stay within Boston Approach airspace you will get a squawk code that is only used inside the Boston TRACON. If you decide to leave the TRACON airspace, for example to go down into Bradley airspace, and still want VFR Flight Following, they will re-issue your squawk code and assign one from the NAS squawk code blocks.

Sometimes when you cross from TRACON to TRACON as a VFR flight they won't be able to effect a handoff - and you have to all the next TRACON for a new squawk code.

-Dave

mielsonwheals · « **Reply #51 on:** April 06, 2011, 21:55:10 UTC »

as if it wasn't already obvious why its not alright to casually land on a public beach...

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-03-16/news/27059193_1_emergency-landing-small-plane-pilot-and-passenger

Tunaheart · « **Reply #52 on:** April 06, 2011, 22:06:31 UTC »

There could be one logical explanantion , i.e CO poisoning in the cockpit which would explain the sick passeneger as well, but considering his behavior prior to taking off from Republic it seems hes just an idiot or a drugged up pilot.

His behavior if voluntary should be used as an example and he should be fined, license revoked and even criminally prosecuted. He gives us all a black eye..

Fred_Garvin · « **Reply #53 on:** April 06, 2011, 23:14:09 UTC »

I don't know this guy but I know some like him. Long on book learning short on common sense. Never really held responsible for his actions till he gets out in the real world and learns the hard way.

Besides the immediate damage to the aircraft I hate to think what that salt water bath is going to do long term

hudsonriver · « **Reply #54 on:** April 07, 2011, 00:23:02 UTC »

First time poster here. I heard this loony bin fly into SWF from FRG on Sunday. I've been listening to ATC for over 15 years, and thought this guy to be downright dangerous. After reading the news articles and seeing N132ND splashed all over them, I wanted to share what I heard upstate:

If you look at the track log in Flightaware on that flight (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N132ND/history/20110403/1445Z/KFRG/KSWF), you'll see the track ends in the mountainous river valley area, southeast of SWF. He was with NY Approach on 132.75 talking about being low - something about 1200', if I remember correctly. Suddenly, several quotes of 'JESUS!' 'WOW!' 'WOAH!' were broadcast on the frequency - 'ND got taken for a ride in the windy conditions over the mountains that day, and it was definitely a scary moment to listen to. I don't know if he wanted to get up close and personal with the scenery or what, but the plane must've gotten tossed about bigtime. He even got scolded by another pilot on frequency that he was transmitting such things on the air and needed to keep that inside. Anyway, after the excitement, he progressed to SWF for landing on 34. He made a reference to Top Gun and going 'really really fast' down the runway, and requested a low approach to go around again for landing. As with JFK tower, he was trying to be chatty with SWF tower as well (who, rightly so, also wanted no part of it).

Sorry, I don't broadcast my feed (yet?) to LiveATC. Just wanted to share this, as I found it pretty unprofessional of someone who 'plays' in an industry where professionalism is required 24/7.

dylanh · « **Reply #55 on:** April 07, 2011, 01:03:58 UTC »

Quote from: hudsonriver on April 07, 2011, 00:23:02 UTC

...you'll see the track ends in the hilly river valley area, southeast of SWF. He was with NY Approach on 132.75 talking about being low - something about 1200', if I remember correctly. Suddenly, several quotes of 'JESUS!' 'WOW!' 'WOAH!' were broadcast on the frequency - 'ND got taken for a ride in the windy conditions over the hills that day, and it was definitely a scary moment to listen to.

Fixed.

KBED1185 · « **Reply #56 on:** April 07, 2011, 01:53:31 UTC »

Quote from: dave on April 05, 2011, 15:51:57 UTC

This airplane was in perfectly good shape prior to this landing (verified by the owner today).

I flew alongside it all the way back from North Dakota when it was transported out here about 8 years ago. I was flying a different (faster) aircraft from UND out here at the time. I just remembered this today - hard to forget since the trip took a week due to weather! The aircraft (the Piper Cherokee) was on a "Day VFR Only" restriction by the FSDO but was inspected and any small issues resolved once it got back here.

By the way, East Coast Aero Club is a top-notch flight school and maintenance is one of their strong points - they are meticulous. I did my instrument training there and highly recommend them (for those near Boston, MA, Nashua, NH, or Norwood, MA).

Dave, you never got the chance to fly 2ND during your instrument training at Hanscom? I have flown this aircraft dozens of times during my Private-SEL training at East Coast, including recently - with no issues whatsoever.

I second your comment regarding the flight school/club's maintenance practices, they keep a number of heavily-used aircraft in excellent condition and pay close attention to pertinent pilot squawks for maintenance, which is critical.

Overall, East Coast has had some terrible luck with their aircraft over the past few years, but they remain one of the best in the country at what they do.

dave · « **Reply #57 on:** April 07, 2011, 01:56:10 UTC »

Nope...mainly flew N75202 and a couple others. Took my checkride in N75202. Then went on to fly almost all the Arrows on the line.

gcampb · « **Reply #58 on:** April 07, 2011, 05:10:47 UTC »

Surprised the FAA has not issued an emergency revocation of his certificate. Technically this guy could get back in an a/c and fly right now.

andrej · « **Reply #59 on:** April 07, 2011, 06:01:36 UTC »

The kid sounds so weird! I hate this annoying 'roger' calls. Maybe he was trying to show off in-front of this friends, maybe or maybe he is a lost case. But kudos to ATC for being so patient with him.

tyson766 · « **Reply #60 on:** April 07, 2011, 11:04:48 UTC »

Quote from: FlyinMN on April 05, 2011, 19:15:52 UTC

I think he's under the influence. Of what, I have no idea.

Hepped up on goofballs.

dave · « **Reply #61 on:** April 07, 2011, 13:11:56 UTC »

http://www.flightschoollist.com/aviation-articles/2011/04/pilot-may-lose-license-over-beach-landing/

englishpilot · « **Reply #62 on:** April 07, 2011, 14:47:47 UTC »

I would like to add - I hope that NY sues him for the cost of the emergency services & helicopter & the recovery costs not to mention the insurance company - they ought to sue him through subrogation.

Hollis · « **Reply #63 on:** April 07, 2011, 17:00:47 UTC »

Not to put a damper on all the comments and speculations about the 'bad' guy's behavior, let me postulate this, based on several previous comments and other info:
1. Ill passenger on board, who was subsequently hospitalized.
2. Possible excessive CO, or a medical condition from other causes, known as prime causes of Anoxia or Hypoxia, the result of which can lead to feelings of euphoria and subsequent seizures as a result. Sound familiar? I hope he gets a Catscan and an MRI.
I only say this because, as the saying goes, 'been there, done that'.

Fred_Garvin · « **Reply #64 on:** April 07, 2011, 19:05:30 UTC »

I am interested to hear about your experience if it is something you want to share.

tomgallagher · « **Reply #65 on:** April 07, 2011, 21:18:13 UTC »

Sounds like a case for pulling his ticket.

Hollis · « **Reply #66 on:** April 07, 2011, 21:54:53 UTC »

My experiences? Had a few, but a closely related one goes like this:
Climb to the altitude where the unpressurized fuel (fuel boost off) starts to 'boil'. Shut down turbine engine and try restarts to determine highest altitude at which the engine will start. 1st attempt, hot start. 2nd attempt, hot start, 3rd attempt, Uh oh. ICS went dead, gyro tumbled, lost all electric instrumentation. Intinctively, I keyed the mic and declared a Mayday, again and again. Got no response. A check of the battery voltage showed a big fat zero. (Found out later that it had a dead short). Got a visual on our home airport and silently headed on down.
Just for reference, we had been operating at altitudes between 22,000 and
25,000 ft. unpressurized and without any O2 on board. Easy to do if you breathe real slow and real deep while there, but only fora limited time.
Finally, after that very long descent, entered the left crosswind leg at which point I actually opened and began yelling out the side window 'Mayday, mayday, mayday - engine out'. Of course no one heard me, but we laughed as we did the LH pattern to touchdown which turned out to be a bit short of the runway. More laughs.

Fred_Garvin · « **Reply #67 on:** April 07, 2011, 22:34:27 UTC »

That makes me think of the Kalitta flight I heard on Liveatc some time back where the pilot struggled to pronounce every word.

Since this was at low altitude I assume it would be something like Carbon monoxide?
I thought the symptoms of that were more feeling sick or drowsy. He certainly can't be accused of sounding drowsy!

Thanks for telling your story. I think you can learn more in one "there I was" story than in text on theory. Sounds like you did a great job to get it down

slacktide · « **Reply #68 on:** April 07, 2011, 23:02:26 UTC »

kdraper · « **Reply #69 on:** April 07, 2011, 23:19:01 UTC »

It is idiots like this that give general aviation a bad name!!!

n6256c · « **Reply #70 on:** April 08, 2011, 03:00:42 UTC »

This guy is a total idiot and he should lose his ticket permanently.

FlyinMN · « **Reply #71 on:** April 08, 2011, 16:02:24 UTC »

Quote from: hudsonriver on April 07, 2011, 00:23:02 UTC

First time poster here. I heard this loony bin fly into SWF from FRG on Sunday. I've been listening to ATC for over 15 years, and thought this guy to be downright dangerous. After reading the news articles and seeing N132ND splashed all over them, I wanted to share what I heard upstate:

If you look at the track log in Flightaware on that flight (http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N132ND/history/20110403/1445Z/KFRG/KSWF), you'll see the track ends in the mountainous river valley area, southeast of SWF. He was with NY Approach on 132.75 talking about being low - something about 1200', if I remember correctly. Suddenly, several quotes of 'JESUS!' 'WOW!' 'WOAH!' were broadcast on the frequency - 'ND got taken for a ride in the windy conditions over the mountains that day, and it was definitely a scary moment to listen to. I don't know if he wanted to get up close and personal with the scenery or what, but the plane must've gotten tossed about bigtime. He even got scolded by another pilot on frequency that he was transmitting such things on the air and needed to keep that inside. Anyway, after the excitement, he progressed to SWF for landing on 34. He made a reference to Top Gun and going 'really really fast' down the runway, and requested a low approach to go around again for landing. As with JFK tower, he was trying to be chatty with SWF tower as well (who, rightly so, also wanted no part of it).

Sorry, I don't broadcast my feed (yet?) to LiveATC. Just wanted to share this, as I found it pretty unprofessional of someone who 'plays' in an industry where professionalism is required 24/7.

Would love to hear that audio if you have it.

keith · « **Reply #72 on:** April 08, 2011, 18:34:13 UTC »

I suspect the FAA would like to hear it, too, if they're working on building a case against him.

hudsonriver · « **Reply #73 on:** April 08, 2011, 20:38:55 UTC »

Quote from: FlyinMN on April 08, 2011, 16:02:24 UTC

Would love to hear that audio if you have it.

Nope, I don't record anything. Just happened to be listening to the scanner while it was going on.

themulletburden · « **Reply #74 on:** April 10, 2011, 19:37:18 UTC »

Are we sure this wasn't Tim Martins??

News:

Author Topic: Piper N132ND Beach Landing near JFK (Read 122726 times)