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Air Traffic Monitoring => Aviation Audio Clips => Topic started by: spikerjack on March 05, 2015, 12:07:08 PM

Title: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: spikerjack on March 05, 2015, 12:07:08 PM: The 1600z archive for LGA tower has this incident starting right at the 2 minute mark - with the tower controller calling DL1086 multiple times and receiving no response. Tower informed by on-airport personnel of the MD88 off the runway.

EDIT: this is the full archive freshly downloaded, no modications and many quiet spots after incident once airport closed...
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: NickW557 on March 05, 2015, 12:20:34 PM: Here's a version with most of the silence removed. It also includes the end of the 1530z archive where DAL1086 is given his initial landing clearance.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: aevins on March 05, 2015, 12:42:02 PM: Impressive recording. The local controller obviously had nothing out the window. Port was in the right place at the right time.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: rustybugs11 on March 05, 2015, 01:12:51 PM: Nicely done Nick and the original poster. Anyone know what the weather conditions were? I am assuming snow obscuring any view from the tower.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: aevins on March 05, 2015, 01:14:37 PM: Quote from: rustybugs11 on March 05, 2015, 01:12:51 PM
Nicely done Nick and the original poster. Anyone know what the weather conditions were? I am assuming snow obscuring any view from the tower.

KLGA 051640Z 32014KT 1/4SM R04/2400V4000FT SN FZFG SCT007 OVC012 M03/M05 A3015 RMK AO2 SFC VIS 1/2 PRESRR P0005
KLGA 051631Z 36009KT 1/4SM R04/3500VP6000FT SN FZFG VV012 M03/M05 A3012 RMK AO2SFC VIS 1/2 P0004
KLGA 051622Z 01008KT 1/4SM R04/3000VP6000FT SN FZFG VV011 M03/M05 A3012 RMK AO2SFC VIS 1/2 P0003
KLGA 051551Z 01008KT 1/4SM R04/2800V3500FT SN FZFG VV009 M03/M05 A3012 RMK AO2 SLP199 P0006 T10331050
KLGA 051524Z 04007KT 1/4SM R04/2600V2800FT SN FZFG VV009 M03/M04 A3013 RMK AO2 P0004
KLGA 051451Z 03010KT 1/4SM R04/3000V4500FT SN FZFG VV012 M03/M04 A3014 RMK AO2 TWR VIS 3/4 SLP207 P0003 60013 T10281044 53040

From http://www.avherald.com/h?article=482b659f&opt=0 (http://www.avherald.com/h?article=482b659f&opt=0).

Controller calls out the RVR's on the tape.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: trichorse on March 06, 2015, 08:20:16 PM: I was told by my father, who had seen it on the news, that heavy ground fog had occured and, coupled with the freezing temperatures, had caused the ice on the runway just 10 minutes after the runway had last been cleared. It's likely that the same fog that caused the ice also obscured the Tower's view of the runway.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: smg1z28 on March 07, 2015, 11:29:13 AM: Too close for comfort????

DL 1999 got as low as 700 ft before being told to go around.
DL 1086 never reported the crash.
Good thing car 100 saw what was going on & reported to the tower, if DL1999 landed, I think this would have had a bad outcome.

I synced this passur link (http://www4.passur.com/lga.html) to the real time audio & listened a few times.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: trichorse on March 07, 2015, 04:37:49 PM: I think the pilots of DL1086 must have been knocked around a bit as they skidded...it's possible they were unable to respond either due to being knocked around or their communications got knocked out during it.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: oktalist on March 07, 2015, 05:10:39 PM: Quote from: smg1z28 on March 07, 2015, 11:29:13 AM
Too close for comfort????

DL 1999 got as low as 700 ft before being told to go around.
DL 1086 never reported the crash.
Good thing car 100 saw what was going on & reported to the tower, if DL1999 landed, I think this would have had a bad outcome.

Surely in low visibility operations, tower would've been required to issue the go around anyway, in the absence of any report of 1086 vacating normally.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: cptbrw on March 07, 2015, 08:26:00 PM: I'm curious as to whether or not ASDE would have detected/reported the aircraft off of the runway (assuming LaGuardia has a working ASDE system).
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: dbperry on March 09, 2015, 04:20:18 PM: NTSB Issues Second Update on the Delta Flight 1086 Accident at LaGuardia

http://www.ntsb.gov/news/press-releases/Pages/PR20150309.aspx
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: trichorse on March 11, 2015, 12:15:47 PM: "Signal Quality degraded" (not an exact quote since I don't have the report up on the page in front of me) makes it sounds like the coms on 1086 got knocked out, so they couldn't respond to tower when it called them.
Title: Re: Delta 1086 off runway LGA 3-5-15
Post by: armenaut on March 12, 2015, 06:34:55 PM: Quote from: trichorse on March 11, 2015, 12:15:47 PM
"Signal Quality degraded" (not an exact quote since I don't have the report up on the page in front of me) makes it sounds like the coms on 1086 got knocked out, so they couldn't respond to tower when it called them.

The reference, as I read the interim report, is to the quality of the flight data recorder, not communications. The heading where this appears is, "A preliminary readout of the Flight Data Recorder found[.]" And the full quote states, "That there are degradations in recorded signal quality around the time the airplane departed the runway and extraction and verification of the data is continuing."